In Via
Planning a trip? Or just on the pilgrimage of daily living? We are the podcast at the intersection of faith and travel, assisting you on the journey to encounter Christ. Hear stories, discover travel tips, and learn more about our Catholic faith. Along the way, we’ll show you that if God seeks to meet us in Jerusalem, Rome, Lourdes, Mexico City, or Santiago, he also wants to encounter you - right there in your car, on your run, or in the middle of your workday.
In Via
Walking with Jesus: The Transformative Eucharistic Pilgrimage Across America
Ever wondered how a pilgrimage could transform your life? Meet Danielle Schmitz and Matthew Heidenreich, two inspiring young adults who embarked on the Eucharistic Revival's National Eucharistic Pilgrimage across the United States. This episode of In Via uncovers their emotional and spiritual journey, starting from the initial application process through the summer of their walk with Jesus. Travel with them along the Marian route, from the headwaters of the Mississippi in Minnesota to Indianapolis, and discover how this pilgrimage deeply impacted their faith and lives.
Experience the unpredictable yet spiritually fulfilling daily life of a pilgrim through Danielle and Matthew’s eyes. From walking long distances to engaging in parish events, visiting schools, and nursing homes, they encountered a diverse range of communities and traditions. Listen as they share the beauty of these experiences and the joy found in both the simplicity of walking and the dynamic nature of days filled with multiple activities. They highlight the profound beauty of the universal church’s rich tapestry, woven through their encounters with different communities.
Join us as Danielle and Matthew delve into the powerful intersection of service and Eucharistic Adoration. Through their service at food pantries and moments of Eucharistic Adoration, they found Jesus in both the Eucharist and the poor. They discuss the challenges and blessings of surrendering to God’s plan, the emotional conclusion of their pilgrimage, and the ongoing transformation of their faith and mission. This episode is a testament to the power of Jesus in the Eucharist to transform and unify the Church in America, emphasizing the importance of trust, surrender, and embracing God’s will.
Welcome to In Via, the podcast where we're navigating the pilgrimage of life. We are all in via on the way and we are learning a lot as we go. I'm your host, joan Watson. Join me as we listen to stories, discover travel tips and learn more about our Catholic faith. Along the way, we'll see that if God seeks to meet us in Jerusalem, rome or Santiago, he also wants to encounter you right there in your car, on your run or in the middle of your workday.
Joan Watson:You don't want to miss this episode. I really think this is one of the most powerful episodes of Envia we've recorded so far. We talked to Matthew and Danielle, who are both perpetual pilgrims from this past summer's Eucharistic pilgrimage across the country, and they have powerful, powerful words to share. So thank you both for joining us on In Via to tell the story of your wonderful summer. I'm really excited to hear these stories about the pilgrimage and I'd like to just start by asking you guys to introduce yourself. Danielle, do you want to start? Just tell us where you're from and maybe what route you walked.
Danielle Schmitz:Yeah my name is Danielle Schmitz. I'm originally from Santa Clara, California, and I'm currently a senior at the Catholic University of America out in Washington DC, and I was on the Marion route this summer.
Joan Watson:Great and Matthew .
Matthew:Yeah, my name is Matthew Heidenreich. I'm originally from Columbus, ohio. I live in Tuscaloosa, alabama, where I'm a junior at the University of Alabama, and I was also on the Marion route, so Danielle and I were walking together.
Joan Watson:Oh nice, so you have our. So the Marion route was the one that started at the headwaters of the Mississippi in Minnesota, correct, and then, of course, ended in Indianapolis. That was actually the route that I got to participate in as well because I'm in South Bend, and so when you all came through and went to Notre Dame, those were the events I was at. So it's a little Marion route reunion. That's exciting.
Joan Watson:So I have lots of questions and and I actually got questions from people who followed along on social media, who were at the revival, so we're all very excited to hear kind of the insider experience of this Eucharistic pilgrimage. We actually talked to Will Peterson from Modern Catholic Pilgrim. So, listeners, if you haven't listened to that episode, we talked to him before it even started. So he kind of gave us the hopes and the dreams and the fears of what was going to happen. So it's fun to kind of wrap it up and talk about now afterwards. Danielle, could you just talk a little bit about what prompted you to even apply for this and what the process was like to be chosen as a perpetual pilgrim?
Danielle Schmitz:Yeah. So I heard about the pilgrimage from my campus, from my college campus ministry and from some work that I was able to participate in at the USCCB, and I was handed the application like a physical flyer to apply twice in the same day. And so I was like maybe I should actually look into this and not just brush it off. And it was one of those situations where I saw the opportunity, you know, walk with Jesus for two months, travel across the country, be on pilgrimage, be on mission in such a unique way. And I was like, wow, this is amazing, this is something I've dreamed about. Like so many people dream about just being able to walk with Jesus like that. But there's no way I'm ever going to get it.
Danielle Schmitz:I knew that lots of people were applying.
Danielle Schmitz:I knew the people that were way more qualified than me on paper were applying, people that had worked for pilgrimage companies, people that had high positions in different missionary apostolates, and so I was like what's the point of applying if I know there's no way I'm going to get it?
Danielle Schmitz:And it was actually my parents, that I was on the phone with them talking about this opportunity and my parents just said Danielle, there's not going to be another opportunity where you're a young adult in the Catholic Church in America, where the Catholic Church in America is asking young adults to walk with Jesus, like you have to give it a chance. And so I filled out the application and it was a pretty lengthy written application and then you got an email inviting you to start the interview rounds. And so when I got the first email asking me to interview, I was like there's no way, this is real. Like what? Especially because everyone I knew didn't get an interview. And so I went through the first round and I was like okay, that's for sure it nothing's going to happen after this. And then I got um another email that said we want to interview you again and I was like someone's pranking me right now.
Danielle Schmitz:There's no way this is actually happening. And I went through the second round of interviews and I walked out of it and I was like, yeah, definitely not getting this job. And then on January 21st, I got an email that said welcome to the Marian route. And I could not believe it. It was a situation where I desired it so greatly. I, as I was filling out the application, as I was interviewing, I just came to realize that all of my desires for being on mission in the church, everything I desired to see happening in the American church on the revival I just was interceding for before I was even applying perfectly aligned with the mission of the revival and the pilgrimage. And it was a situation where I was asking Jesus. I was like Jesus, I really want to be a part of this and, if it's your will, I'd really love for you to make it happen. And I'm just so grateful that he allowed me to be a part of a mission that I had been praying for and desiring to participate in before I even knew it existed.
Joan Watson:I love that. I love how the Holy Spirit first of all works, chooses those of us who might feel unworthy or not qualified, but that the Holy Spirit has this beautiful plan for us and that you, like, acutely, knew what you were, what you were interceding for, in that I mean there were some people who had never even heard of the revival of the, of the pilgrimages, and so for you to be interceding and praying for it and then get to be a part of it, I think is just a beautiful way the Lord works in our life. He doesn't always pick the people that, on paper, look like they should be picked, but he has a plan and you clearly needed to be part of this. So you have the kickoff and you started at the head. Both of you started at the headwaters of the Mississippi.
Joan Watson:Matthew, can you talk a little bit about what that was like? What was going through your mind as you begin this adventure? And there's this big kickoff celebration to actually that all of this you were planning and waiting for actually was about to happen. What was that like?
Matthew:I think I can speak for both Danielle and I when I say that first week is kind of burned into our minds because it was just so special. Everything was unfolding for the first time right in front of our eyes. And I think that Pentecost Mass we started at Lake Itasca, like you just said. We had this massive outdoor Mass and this big green space and it was kind of just this feeling of everything being unknown and watching it unfold in front of our eyes. Like as we pulled up we had no idea how many people would be there. People said anywhere from like you know nobody, to like 5,000 people are going to show up at the headwaters. And even then we didn't know how many people were going to follow us for that first procession. So we started at one spot where there was like this large space for mass and then we had a procession about a mile long down to the parking lot for the headwaters of the Mississippi and then there was a benediction and then a shorter procession continued on to the actual headwaters, and so we had no idea how many people were just going to like stay at the parking lot and just watch us go, and how many would actually follow us and I remember, like our pilgrim team was in the beginning of the procession, in the front we were kind of like Jesus was here and there were a bunch of sisters, and then it was us and then everybody else and we had no idea if there would be an everybody else. We didn't know if it would just be us walking. So I remember getting like halfway down the hill and turning around and seeing just like so so many people behind us, the entire road filled with people, from like shoulder to median, just people everywhere and just being moved.
Matthew:I think in that moment it was a realization that people are actually excited about this. I was excited about it, danielle was excited about it. Like we've been thinking about this for months but realizing like wow, the church is hungry for this, the church is hungry to follow our Eucharistic Lord, and that realization that the church was open to what Jesus wanted to give through the revival was very, very powerful for us. And then actually getting down to the headwaters and starting that journey. It's just every step you knew that something was happening, that something was changing, and I remember realizing that the person I was at the headwaters was a very different person than I would be, and am now two months later that so much has changed. And it was that feeling of knowing you're going to be transformed to the next 60 days. It's wild.
Joan Watson:Yeah, wow, that's a gift, because a lot of times you don't know when transformation's happening until you look back. But to know like this is something happening, like this is something happening in my life, this is something happening in the church, to have that like realization that I'm on the brink of something, because a lot of times the Lord brings us someplace and then we look back and we're like, oh, that's what you were doing, oh, that's funny. But you all were part of this moment where you actually could probably count the days of like okay, this is where it starts and then where Indianapolis is where it ends, but it doesn't really end, of course, and so we'll talk about that, of course. Danielle, could you talk about your average day, you know, because I think a lot of us we saw you, maybe at certain points of the journey, but are you walking the whole time? Did you start at the headwaters and never stop walking? What was your average day like, or was there an average day?
Danielle Schmitz:You know, on the Marion route we created a ninth beatitude which is blessed are the flexible? Because there really was. There was really pretty much like no consistency in schedule, which turned out to be a really beautiful thing that every day you woke up and you look into the schedule or we had our debrief and you're like this is completely different than what we did before. Um, I would say, if I had to sort of categorize it, there were pretty much three different options of what could happen throughout an average day. Um, saturdays, just so people know, looked normally different, because on Saturdays we would do our service time and then we'd normally have a few hours of rest and sort of reset of like the van, any logistical things we needed to take care of, and then normally a few evening events, so a holy hour or a potluck or a social event with a parish or diocese.
Danielle Schmitz:But Sunday through Friday, there are basically three different ways a day could go. Normally. It pretty much always starts with mass first thing in the morning, and then we would either go like from mass just straight into walking and you just walk for like 14 miles and then get to the next parish and then that's the day. In a sense that was like the quote unquote ideal day on pilgrimage, of just sort of like you were walking and those normally would be days with smaller crowds. But we did have one day when we were in St Cloud, minnesota, where we had like 300 people with us for a 12 mile procession, so sometimes it would be 25. Sometimes it'd be 300, 400 on those long days.
Danielle Schmitz:Um, the next option of day would be we'd have mass in the morning and then we'd have several short walking processions and we'd sort of be bouncing from church to church, either walking fully to the next church or having a stopping point and then getting in the van, driving and then doing another short procession to hit more parishes within the diocese.
Danielle Schmitz:And then the third option of the day would be mass and then several events at different parishes which could be holy hours. They could be talks, they could be more masses, a holy hour and a really short procession around the grounds. And it was on those days we had really unique opportunities of getting to go and talk to little kids in the school and bring them Jesus and explain to them like this is Jesus, everyone, say hi to Jesus. Or we get to go visit nursing homes, we get to do driving processions and actually go to cloistered religious communities and bring them our Lord. So there was very little consistency from day to day what our schedule looked like, but I can say that every day we'd have mass, we'd spend a lot of time with Jesus, we'd walk and we'd probably drive a lot too. We covered a lot of ground.
Joan Watson:That's incredible, because I think part of me can't imagine like the walking 14 miles, whereas I think that's probably what people thought you were doing. You were just starting and walking Right, Um, but that's a long time to walk. But at the same time, I think I would like those days where I didn't have to be on and I could just walk and pray and like the activities seemed like they would be hard logistically, even Like we have to get to this place at this certain amount of time and there's all these events and was, I guess Matthew, I'll ask you, was that hard sometimes Like to be with all these different places and all these different times? And were there ever days where you're just like can I just walk?
Matthew:No, you nailed it. Those days like I think we had a. We had a.
Matthew:One of our last long processions was like this 14, 15 mile procession in Gary, Indiana, and at a certain point I found myself like really looking forward to those days because it's just a chance to like really enter in and pray and there's a very there's a, there's a very deep consistency to what you're doing in a way.
Matthew:Right, I mean, walking is always unpredictable, You're always in new environments, but it's kind of that same heart posture of entering it with the Lord. But when you're doing kind of these spontaneous events, every event's a little different and you're not entirely sure what the parish needs or what the parish is doing or where the people are at, and sometimes you don't even know what the event is. You pull up and you're like, okay, they need a testimony, they need two testimonies, they want our preacher to get up there and do his thing and preach, you know. And so you almost have to have even more flexibility on those days with like lots of different events, because you're just kind of hopping in into a situation you may or may not have a full awareness of which in a way, is beautiful too.
Matthew:All of our events were incredible and I'm super blessed we got to be there. But, yeah, definitely the walking after a while was like okay, we know how to do this.
Joan Watson:Yes, yeah, and just incredible amount of the variety of experiences you had in the different communities that welcomed you in their own way and had their own traditions and their own customs, and just to see the universal church in that way, that you're walking a small part of the United States but there's the melting pot of the United States that you were able to experience and just the different communities and their traditions I'm sure was really beautiful and you were able to serve in those communities. So, danielle, could you talk a little bit about what you mentioned on Saturdays? It sounds like you all never rested Like. You even worked on Saturday when you did service work. Did you ever think I just want to sit on the couch? So what was the Saturday? The service opportunities, what were those like?
Danielle Schmitz:At the beginning of the summer, like you said, they were actually really hard. I had a couple conversations with our route coordinator of just having this internal conflict of service, especially service to the poor, something that's really important to me and something I normally participate in outside of the pilgrimage, and so I wanted to be really excited about going to serve these communities. But I was like Maria our route coordinator. I told her I was like Maria, I just need like four hours off, I just need a little bit of a break. And it was hard because, in a sense, like the thing that was standing between me and my break was the service. And, um, about two or three weeks into the summer, our team lead actually told us, like you know, um, she had talked to the national team and if we needed to take Saturday mornings off, we could, like we could ask for Saturday mornings off and take them. And it was that week that we were in Green Bay, Wisconsin, and we were going to serve at a food pantry and I had this moment of interior conflict, of I was. I was really like physically, mentally, spiritually exhausted and I was like, okay, I can take this morning off or I can go serve, and it was just a moment where I really felt the Lord inviting me to like go and and serve, even though I really didn't want to go, I really wanted to just rest.
Danielle Schmitz:And we got to this food pantry and it was such a beautiful opportunity because, as we were going, we mostly served uh, at least I did. Normally we'd have a couple options, but I ended up serving mostly at places helping people with food insecurity. And as I was standing in this food pantry, it was set up like a grocery store, which was so beautiful in preserving the dignity of the people that were shopping there. Of that, it wasn't just being handed a box of food, but they actually had choice over what they were receiving. And my job in the food pantry was to check off people's marker to make sure they hadn't come through more than once and just help them if they needed anything.
Danielle Schmitz:And where they had me standing, I was staring directly at an image of the sacred heart and underneath it just said come to me all you who are weary and heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
Danielle Schmitz:And it was this moment in my heart of truly connecting for the first time that actually a part of my resting in the Lord, that I receive in receiving him through the Eucharist, is to rest in him in the poor.
Danielle Schmitz:That, like his sacred heart in the poor, in those that are needy and hungry and needing our shelter and our support as Catholics, is that same idea of me going to prayer in the tabernacle with and resting with him in the tabernacle, or when I receive him in the Eucharist and resting with him there, that my heart could find rest in his sacred heart in the poor.
Danielle Schmitz:And every single person that I encountered as we stayed there for a couple hours I was able to definitively look at them and be like this is Jesus in front of me and this is an encounter with Jesus where he not only wants me to give but he wants me to receive.
Danielle Schmitz:And that completely changed the trajectory of the summer, of how I viewed those service times and they became my one of my favorite parts of every week that I was able to not only give of myself in such a profound way but to also just receive so much from the people we served that I was able to truly encounter Christ in them in a way I never had before, and I was able to understand that the only reason I was able to see Christ in them was because Jesus was giving me the opportunity to be so intimately united with him in the Eucharist through just the way the summer worked and us being with him all the time. I know that if he hadn't given me that grace of being with him in the Eucharist, I never would have been able to actually see him in the people we were serving this summer.
Joan Watson:Yeah, that's so powerful. And so it reminds me of Mother Teresa, who was only able to do what she was able to do because they spent hours of adoration. And when she thought she was running out of time to serve the poor, she said we have to do another adoration, we have to do another holy hour. Right, if we're running out of time to serve the poor, we need to spend more time in adoration, which the world would say was crazy. But she knew that's where she was finding her strength.
Joan Watson:And I think there's people that want it to pit finding Jesus in the poor and finding Jesus in the Eucharist against each other. But it sounds like you had the exact opposite, that no, it's both, and, as the church loves the both and right. And so you know, you were both bringing Jesus to the poor, but then also receiving Jesus through the poor, just as you were bringing Christ in the Eucharist to all these cities, but then he was also coming to you, and it's that giving and receiving, it's just. I just kind of stand in awe of what you just said and that beauty of it's not either or, but it's the both, and it's the giving and the receiving, and it's in the Eucharist and in the poor, and they don't have to be in conflict at all. In fact, they have to be united. They have to be united. I think I can think of lots of difficulties that must have faced you this summer, but, matthew, could you kind of speak about one maybe unexpected difficulty that you may be experienced on the route?
Matthew:Yeah, I think a big unexpected difficulty for me was entering into the surrender of the schedule. You know, every diocese we went to we were handed a schedule that had been created months in advance and and oftentimes those schedules were rather packed to try and get us to lots of different places and lots of different parishes. And I think a lot of us, as you kind of already talked about, had expectations of what this pilgrimage would be. I personally expected walking from the headwaters all the way to Indianapolis and in the first couple of weeks of kind of formation and learning about the pilgrimage, it was clear that's not what we're going to do. And so there was kind of this in the first couple of weeks, this tension for me of wanting to do specific things like oh, I want to walk this much or I really want to visit these places or spend this amount of time here, and oftentimes that just wasn't the schedule for the day and I would be kind of frustrated or I'd be like digging my heels in to try and get what I wanted from the pilgrimage and I don't remember exactly where this started happening. I think probably like halfway in, probably a similar spot to where Danielle had that experience that she just shared with us.
Matthew:I just started to enter into like little acts of surrender and started to realize that the schedule that the Lord had given and prepared and that our pilgrimage team had discerned right, that was exactly where he wanted us to be, and the reason that we weren't doing so much walking was simply because he didn't want us to.
Matthew:He wanted us to be at these parishes, he wanted to enter into these places.
Matthew:And I found myself saying, throughout the whole pilgrimage, I want to be where he is, just wherever he is Right. And I realized that in some ways I was, I was being untrue because I wanted to be walking but he didn't. He wanted to be at this parish, and so I had to kind of enter into that surrender of being like no Lord, I'm just going to follow you. Wherever you're going, I'll go, and I don't know. I personally think I experienced a lot more grace just being with our Lord. There were experiences that I had at certain parishes that I never would have had otherwise, and I'm very grateful that the Lord gave that grace to be able to kind of enter into that. Even in places where the schedule was very different or challenging or unpredictable, there was definitely a level of grace or something that the Lord wanted to give to each of us in those days, but it was definitely challenging to enter into that.
Joan Watson:Yeah, you know, the purpose of this podcast is to talk about the pilgrimage of life and to see little pilgrimages as reflective of life, our big pilgrimage that we're on, and isn't that the lesson that we have to learn every day in our lives? But I love that like to step into the surrender of the schedule, to really step into that surrender of the Lord that we want to be in charge. We think we know it's right, like that's my daily life right, like I think I know where I should be and what I should be doing and what the Lord should be doing Right. And to learn that, oh, it's supposed to be flipped, like I'm, I'm supposed to be listening to him and be where he wants me to be, and, um, it's really easy to talk about but it's really hard to, uh, to step into the surrender Right, and so to learn that in that, that not so little way this summer, um, and then to try to take it into okay, how do I live my life like that, um, when I I might not have a schedule given to me by a committee the rest of this year, but, um, I definitely have a schedule that I want to want to live by and what is? Where does the Lord want me?
Joan Watson:Um, and so there were so many things that you said that resonated with me, um, even that idea of expectations and to get what you want out of the pilgrimage. What does the Lord want you to get out of that pilgrimage? And that can be a really hard lesson. Let's not just talk about the difficulties, let's also talk about the joys. Danielle, can you share maybe one of your favorite cities or one of your favorite places, or one of your favorite experiences along the way?
Danielle Schmitz:I would have to say that one of my favorite I'm going to say diocese. I loved all the diocese, just in case any of them are listening, I loved, I genuinely loved, every single diocese we went to and every. At the end of them I was like, yeah, I can move here, like I can just just spend the rest of my life here. But I want to talk about the Archdiocese of Milwaukee because it was absolutely insane. Um, we visited 62 parishes in eight days and they had us walking 10 plus miles every day and they had just created this absolutely insane logistical schedule that somehow worked every single day, even though you look at the doc and you're like, oh my gosh, this is six hours of scheduling and it's four pages long. But they made everything work and it was just I. I loved it so much because it was so hard. But every single person from the archdiocese that we encountered was so excited that we were there. Like these parishes pulled out every single stop to make sure that, like, as many people from the parish were there as possible, even if it was just for us literally being at their parish for 15 minutes. Like in those 15 minutes they'd have a full choir and they'd have snacks waiting for us and they the church would already be filled. And it was when we were in the archdiocese of milwaukee that I I just had this realization of like, oh, this is like, this is important to me, but this is like so important to these people, like this isn't just an opportunity for them, like this isn't just a fun thing to be a part of, but they see this as a necessary part of revival in the archdiocese. And Matthew's actually wearing a shirt right now from the archdiocese in Milwaukee that they made and they just said revival.
Danielle Schmitz:And the entire time we were in the Archdiocese we kept hearing that phrase over and over again Of people not just being excited to be part of the National Eucharistic Revival and the pilgrimage, but people that were so genuinely convicted that us coming to them, jesus coming to them, was going to be a moment of radical shift in the archdiocese, and so they were willing to put put on this insane schedule and go to 62 parishes in eight days and have overnight adoration and every night and just sort of had this.
Danielle Schmitz:Like it felt like boot camp, like it was the most intense week of the entire pilgrimage for me and, I know, for a lot of the other team members, but it was so worth it because it felt like we were actually seeing the fruits in real time that Jesus was coming through, and it almost felt like that moment of when Jesus encounters the woman at the well of the Samaritan woman, like immediately running off and being like I have to bring people to Jesus, because you'd have people that came the first day and then they'd bring friends back the next day and we kept seeing in real time. The Gospels lived out in the most literal way of the entire summer summer, and so Milwaukee will always just have a really special place in my heart of getting to see revival happen in real time, which is a privilege I never thought I would have on this side of heaven.
Joan Watson:Wow, just to think of the joy, the hunger, the reaction of, I mean think about how many individuals were touched personally this summer and stories you'll never know. You won't know till heaven, right, somebody will come up to you and say, like I was in Milwaukee and that's why I'm in heaven today. Right, like just that, um, just the way the Lord can touch so many. And, yeah, you had a glimpse of, like the public ministry of Christ who, when crowds came running to him and and the word spread and people were hungry and the sheep without the shepherd, right, like your heart was probably moved with the compassion, like Jesus and just the unique vision you had of the body of Christ, so hungry for revival. Just talking to you gives me hope for the church that so many were hungry. Matthew, could you share also, like maybe just one unexpected joy of the summer? We know your unexpected difficulty, but what was one of the joys of this adventure?
Matthew:So I should preface this by saying that this was my first pilgrimage. I did like a service pilgrimage to Guadalupe in March, but really this is my first experience of pilgrimage, and so I think what I'm going to share is kind of like a common experience for a lot of people, but it was something that caught me totally off guard. I'm very much so a relationship person I think my teammates could attest to that. I love meeting people, I'm an extrovert, and so I think the unexpected joy for me was all of the relationships I was able to form across the country.
Matthew:Um, I was very much so expecting us to be like in and out, like, you know, we drop into a parish and we do our thing, and like Jesus shows up and like he blesses everybody and then we're out, you know, and then we never see anybody again. Um, and that just wasn't the case. In a lot of places we would have people who, for a specific diocese or a specific state, would just keep showing up. Even in the first week there was a group of I think four, I think three sisters and then one of their husbands, who had an RV and would follow us from town to town and just keep showing up for these processions.
Matthew:And they were a hood and a half. They were so funny I was able to befriend them. There was a family of eight that actually followed us the whole way. Holy cow, yeah, literally uprooted everything for the summer, went in their minivan and drove with the whole pilgrimage.
Danielle Schmitz:So relationships like that were incredible.
Matthew:But even just the people that I met for an hour or for maybe like an afternoon, and those relationships that I formed there were very shocking to me. I remember there was a procession where it was actually Milwaukee. It was one of our bigger processions and so I was in the very back, which is kind of a different atmosphere than being in the front, which is very reverent. The back is kind of the space that's more open for those Emmaus moments and holy conversations. And I met someone who was from Colombia and we had this kind of hour-long conversation, entirely in Spanish, about just Colombia and her home and why she was here. And it was a very touching moment, a very good friendship, and it was also actually very providential because it was a moment that helped me prepare for some of the testimonies that I would give later and help me feel more comfortable in my Spanish.
Matthew:But really, just I was shocked by the relationships that I was able to form and I think even now, looking back, I have these clumps of people across the Midwest who, like my heart, just is like burning with his sacred heart, for, like I feel like the Lord has allowed me to receive a piece of his heart for so many of his people across the country and to receive that gift of his heart, for people to receive his love, is something that I'm going to treasure for a long time. And, yeah, I feel like Paul in a lot of ways of I earnestly desire to return these communities and to visit the people that I'm going to treasure for a long time. And, yeah, I feel like Paul in a lot of ways. I earnestly desire to return these communities and to visit the people that I love. And, yeah, it was just such a gift to be able to meet all the people that we did.
Joan Watson:Wow, I feel like this podcast is just me saying that's beautiful, that's incredible, that's powerful, because it's just such a stunning. And I love the comparison to Paul who, you know, ends his letters. So often we overlook Paul, the end of Paul's letters where he addresses all his friends in those places and we just kind of skip over the names. But to think of that, those relationships in the body of Christ, that we don't do pilgrimage by ourselves and you knew you were going to be doing pilgrimage with the perpetual pilgrims but to see the body of Christ pilgrimaging with you, and it's kind of like we were talking about seeing Christ in the Eucharist, seeing Christ in the poor, also seeing Christ in each other, and that doesn't diminish seeing Christ in His real presence in the Eucharist. It helps us, it's necessary, all of these things are necessary, and so to see Christ in the body of Christ in the communities that you walked through and that you met is really powerful.
Joan Watson:I'm picturing you guys being like little celebrities. I don't know how it was like with you. No one probably, I guess, knew you were the Perpetual Pilgrims, but I was just like when I saw you walking in the procession at Indianapolis I was like those are the perpetual pilgrims, like your celebrities in our eyes. When we came to Notre Dame, we had to see the bus, we wanted to see what we had experienced, and when the monstrance came into the church I know my mom, who had been following really closely on social media my mom just started weeping because she was like I've seen him across, like walking across the country, and now he's here and it was again one of those public ministry moments that I think is like so powerful, and so you were like the cool disciples that got to be along the ride for all of it. I'm I'm really so, danielle, could you kind of talk about what it was like when you arrived in Indianapolis and your pilgrimage in pilgrimage in one sense, was over as you arrived and you all arrived. What was that like?
Danielle Schmitz:That day of July 16th of us actually getting to Indianapolis is one I will never forget. The like first level of it was that it was my 21st birthday. So it was like, oh my gosh, it's my birthday and it's the feast of our lady of mount carmel, um. And then, on top of that, it's like the pilgrimage is ending and I was afraid that it wasn't gonna hit me, that I wasn't gonna be able to like fully be present in the day, but thankfully, like that morning, I was able to just be like, yeah, like this is the end of pilgrimage, of like the, the Marian route. And it was such a gift because we had that six mile procession. And for the last three, one of my jobs when we were on route was to lead prayer and song as we walked. And so for the last three miles, myself and our chaplain for that week, father Maliki, we were switching off leading worship because the national team had decided they wanted worship the whole last three miles. And in the Marian route we were really privileged in that we were the last route to get to St John the Evangelist in Indianapolis. So we were the ending of the benediction of Jesus blessing our country, and the last mile, we as a team had decided to take our shoes off as we walked, for several different reasons. Some of us was to stand in solidarity with homeless people that we had met throughout years of service.
Danielle Schmitz:For myself, I really just wanted to fully enter into pilgrimage the way that it would have been um in the medieval times, when pilgrimages became really popular. I'm just that have have that experience, in a sense of of the physical poverty of having no shoes, showing just like the spiritual poverty of like Jesus, this is all for you and we have nothing but you. So we're just going to walk as simply as possible with you. Um. But that experience of leading worship as we're getting to St John's and um to be playing and singing with these people who are worshiping you so freely and so beautifully, and entering in and to see people that don't normally enter into worship, like entering in with hands raised, just like being like this is Jesus, jesus, we love you, like we worship you, and to be walking down the street and see the crowd of people and we were worshiping with a song called Yeshua, which is Jesus's name in Aramaic, and just the intimacy of knowing that, like Jesus only allows those people that he is closest with to call him by you, only allow someone that you're closest with to call, call by your name, like that, um, and that Jesus was allowing us to call him Yeshua and to speak in intimacy with him in that way and just be like standing on the steps of St John's and to have, like I look over and like it's Bishop Cousins who, in a very special way, was a spiritual father to the Marian route, because he walked the first week with us and not only our route, but really spiritual father to the whole pilgrimage, and the next to him was Cardinal Tagli, and they're just worshiping and I'm like oh, oh, my gosh, this moment is insane.
Danielle Schmitz:Jesus, what is going on? And as we walked into St John's, I literally like I couldn't feel my body, and a religious sister friend of mine said that my guardian angel kept playing guitar for me because I just like I don't even have words to describe what it felt like to walk in as we were singing just the phrase Jesus, we love you. You are the one our hearts adore over and over again. And to hear the church filled with music and just be kneeling on the front step of the sanctuary where all the other pilgrims and just knowing we made it, and it was really a moment of I love the image of our mortal life as a time of pilgrimage towards eternity. And when we got to St John's it's so profoundly felt like an image of what going into heaven is going to feel like. It was like you could hear the saints and angels worshiping with us in that moment and I, we, after we had benediction and we got to greet all the other pilgrims, I was kneeling in the pew, um, before mass started and I and I I said to Jesus I was like Jesus, you can take me right now, like this is, this is good, this is amazing.
Danielle Schmitz:And what was so beautiful was that moment of getting to Indianapolis.
Danielle Schmitz:It was just so clear, especially those hours afterwards, that, like, this was just the start of our work as pilgrims, that our time on pilgrimage was, in a sense, living the gospels.
Danielle Schmitz:But it became so clear that now the Lord was calling us into our acts that this is the time to go out and to share and it was definitely just an opportunity to enter into that. As we got to indianapolis, um, I was surprised that people knew who we were. I was walking, I was walking to chick-fil-a and a woman stopped me and she's like you're one of the marion route pilgrims. And I was like yeah, I am. I can't believe you. You know what I look like, that I'm walking down the street and you can find me. But the opportunity of meeting people and getting to share with them little glimpses of what pilgrimage was and really start to share the good news of what the Lord did, that in a sense, the apostles went out and shared the kerygma with the nations during Acts of the Apostles, and it feels like we now get to go and share the kerygma of what the Lord did, of living out the gospels in our country with the rest of the nation that wasn't there to experience it.
Joan Watson:Wow, thank you for sharing that, matthew. You want to add something about Indianapolis too in that experience?
Matthew:Yeah, I think, danielle, I want to expand about something you said. You mentioned the end, like we were the last part of the benediction, and I wanted to explain that a little bit more. It's kind of hard to see, but if you squint your eyes and look at the pilgrimage routes they kind of make a cross over the nation, and that's been described in a couple of different ways as a benediction, as a solemn benediction of our nation, that actually, in this time of, you know, political turmoil in a lot of ways, division, this time, where a lot of people have, you know, questions about the future of our country, that Jesus would actually come and would bless everything. He would bless our nation. And so what Daniel said is being the end of that benediction, we were the last part of the cross. We were the last part of the cross to be completed, to come into St John's, where all of the other routes had already completed their section, and so as we entered into St John's, it was this moment of realizing the Father's will, of seeing it completed.
Matthew:The Lord had a plan for this pilgrimage and he had something that he desired to give our nation through it, and so, as we walked into St John's and followed Jesus. On that last leg, there was this feeling of just like Lord. This is what you earnestly desire to give us, and even though I want this pilgrimage to go on, you want to give this blessing, and I'm just going to lay everything down and just worship you as you do it, as you complete your will, and I think that was just a beautiful image that I wanted to expand upon from Danielle's point that she gave.
Joan Watson:That's beautiful. There's so much more we could talk about and I could ask. I do kind of want to like go outward and kind of look at this experience as a whole, and there have been pessimists who have said like oh, this was like why are you doing this? And this is a waste of time, like the Congress is a waste of time and the pilgrimage is like what's the point Right? Now. I think anybody who's listened to this episode can see how dramatically this has affected the United States, the church and you all. But, matthew, I'll start with you. What would you say, what would you respond to someone who maybe had a pessimistic view of this whole endeavor of the pilgrimages or the revival in general?
Matthew:There were a couple of points along the route where this question kind of came up in different ways of is this kind of the best use of money or time? And just reflecting upon that kind of a question, I was brought. The Lord brought me to the story of Mary of Bethany, where she anoints the feet of Jesus and she takes this expensive jar of perfume and pours it out on his feet and there's people who say like, okay, this could have been sold for 300 days wages given to the poor. But Jesus actually honors her and he honors the sacrifice that she made because of the praise, because of the adoration. It's just something that is beautiful and poured out on his feet. And I think, looking back, that was so much of the experience of the pilgrimage. It was this opportunity for our nation to have that moment of Bethany where we can pour out our praise, our adoration and do something just for his glory, that this is a sacrifice that we can give him and pour out upon his feet. And I mean, at countless points throughout the route, some of which Danielle and I have already shared, we saw those people who would come with their own offering, with their own jar of oil and pour it in the feet of Jesus.
Matthew:I'm brought back to, specifically one community in Sparta, wisconsin. It was this Hispanic community who made these altar stops around a baseball field of all places where Jesus would stop and they would say a prayer and then they continue on the procession. But these altars were just decorated to the nines. There were intricate curtains and fruits and flowers and just anything you could imagine was created on these. It took probably hours and hours of time and it was all for his glory. It was just a place for him to rest, and I think that time and time again that came up on the pilgrimage, because the truth is that those moments, those Bethany moments, are far more important for us than they are for him. He doesn't need those Bethany moments that we do. We need to have that experience of being poured out at his feet, and that was a gift that we gave to him, but that really he gave to us, to have that experience, yeah.
Joan Watson:That's beautiful. How can we be, bethany, and how can we? Yeah, I love that we need those moments more. He doesn't need them, but we need them. Danielle, what would you say to someone who maybe said this was a waste of time or money, or why are we doing this?
Danielle Schmitz:I have two different responses.
Danielle Schmitz:The first is on a very practical level, with all of the logistics and impossibilities that we came, we overcame in the national team planning this and in the pilgrims executing this pilgrimage this summer, there's no way this would have happened if it wasn't the Lord's will.
Danielle Schmitz:Like there's no, there's. On a very practical level. There's no way this would have happened if it wasn't a legitimate movement of the holy spirit, because every single day there were at least five or ten different logistical things that you know. If it wasn't the lord moving, like it just wouldn't have happened. And even when you look at the fact that everyone told bishop cousins that this pilgrimage pilgrimage was impossible and it was a team of five people from Modern Catholic Pilgrim that made it happen, like it's just so clear that this was the Lord's will. So that's sort of my practical response. But I think, on a on just a more personal level of my experience walking this summer, I don't think anything is a waste of money or time if it means even a single soul was saved and I think we have to recognize that someone's eternal soul, being permanently in the beatific vision versus being completely separated from God for the rest of eternity is more important than any money that we have on this earth. It's more important than any time being spent in service to the church, even if we think it's frivolous. And this summer we saw every single day souls being saved. We saw every single day people giving their lives to Jesus.
Danielle Schmitz:And this summer was the hardest two months of my life.
Danielle Schmitz:This was the hardest thing I've ever done, and the thing that kept me going was that every single day, I watched people look Jesus in the eyes and, for the first or the millionth time, realized he was there and fall deeply and profoundly in love with him.
Danielle Schmitz:And that's why we walked. We walked because Jesus wanted to encounter people and Jesus wanted to bring conversion to communities and Jesus wanted people to fall in love with him. And so I think we have to ask ourselves like is it a waste of time and money to allow people to fall in love with Jesus? Is it a waste of time and money to bring people to conversion? Is it a waste of time and money to remind the church that the only thing that matters is Jesus' Eucharistic presence, because everything flows to that and everything flows from it, and I think if we actually took the time to pray about that and reflect on Jesus's Eucharistic presence and the ways he's guided us in our own lives and the ways that we see his Eucharistic presence move in others. I think anyone who has been pushing back against the pilgrimage would come to agree that any time and money is worth people coming to know and love and serve him.
Joan Watson:Amen, amen. You know, so often we try to make programs and initiatives and mission statements and we ask why people aren't coming to church. And we, and it's like, just put Jesus on the altar. Like, put Jesus on the altar Like we don. We don't have vocations. Put Jesus on the altar. You don't have money for your church. Put Jesus on the altar.
Joan Watson:And so I think we saw so clearly this summer that Jesus just wants to meet people. And who are we to stand in the way of Jesus meeting people and bringing people to the Eucharist? Um, I was going to end, danielle, by asking how you thought the the pilgrimages will impact the faith of the United States, and I think you just told us in that answer, um to do, and I also want to talk both of to both of you about how it has impacted your life. But, um, I think we we know that how the faith will be impacted the United States. Is there anything you want to add to that? I don't know what you could add.
Danielle Schmitz:I don't think so. I think just yeah. How will it impact the faith in the United States? I think we are on the edge of a revival that is not only Eucharistic in people coming to know His true presence, not only Eucharistic in people coming to know his true presence, but in that we're going to see the church in America become a Eucharistic community, that we're going to see people coming fully into their identity. I love that image of that.
Danielle Schmitz:To be a Eucharistic community, we have to be given, blessed, broken and shared and in a sense of the pilgrim Jesus gave himself to us and we were given to him in such a profound way of him coming to us and we us coming to meet him.
Danielle Schmitz:And now we get to understand that we've been blessed by him and that we have gifts to share.
Danielle Schmitz:And there's going to be an aspect of of brokenness, that there is a, there's a necessary suffering involved with the sanctification of ourselves and the sanctification of our country, of the church, that we have to allow ourselves to break, that we have to allow ourselves to just surrender those things that we might not want to to, but ultimately that allows us to be shared and to give to others, to share with the poor, to share with those who don't know our Lord, to really enter into mission and evangelization. And so I think in all those ways the pilgrimage will impact the United States faith, and I truly believe that we are going to see a new, profound unity of the church in America after the Eucharistic revival and after the Eucharistic pilgrimage, that church politics and liturgical preferences will no longer be something that comes to divide, but we realize that Jesus' Eucharistic presence is what unites all of that, and so that we can all come together in him, through him and with him in the Eucharist and be the one holy Catholic church that we profess every single day.
Joan Watson:Amen. So I can tell that both of you have prayed a lot this summer and have thought about our Lord and have had times of silence with our Lord, and I think it's so evident from your answers that you have spent time with him, have spent time in silence with him, and that this has really changed your lives. Matthew, you said you knew that how you started at the Headwaters would be you know you'd be a different person. I'd love to just kind of wrap up by asking you and I'll start with you, matthew what's one way this pilgrimage impacted you, or how are you different than you were when you started at the headwaters of the Mississippi?
Matthew:There's been a lot, right, like you said. There's been so many moments, a lot of which I think the Lord is still revealing in his own time and in his own way, some of which relates to vocations, some of which relates to things I've learned about myself and my own desires. I think what I want to share is specifically just this growth and trust that I've experienced throughout the summer. I kind of already alluded to it earlier when I talked about that surrender to the schedule, but I think it was a deep movement of my heart that the Lord gave throughout the summer was to see all the places that I didn't trust the Lord, all those places, like in the schedule or in my identity a lot of times where he had spoken and where I, for whatever reason, didn't listen or I didn't believe. And when you're in front of the Eucharist for that long, when you're with our Eucharistic Lord, things start to get exposed and revealed.
Matthew:I'm sorry there's something that's going to activate the corner over there and be really loud, so I'm going to go kick that. That's a Roomba.
Joan Watson:I know that sound well, yeah, right.
Matthew:Okay, where was I? Thank you, lord, for the interruptions. Right, that there's something that I didn't trust him in, and that time with him kind of brings that to the surface. It highlights those moments that maybe I don't trust him here, and I think there was a lot of healing of that that took place this summer, even just in my identity of like, okay, there's this transition that's happening from being a pilgrim to now not being a pilgrim, or from, you know, never doing a pilgrimage before to doing a pilgrimage. What's my identity in all of this? Who am I? I'm his beloved and that's all that matters.
Matthew:Or in these situations where maybe I don't feel confident to go and speak my testimony in the language that I didn't grow up speaking, you know, or I don't know what I'm doing leading song and prayer in front of thousands of people with a speaker. What am I going to do here? I can trust him. I can trust that he, that he's placed me here for a reason, um, and that his call is good and his call is loving, and I think that that's, um, something that will hopefully continue to shape me for the rest of my life and a milestone of realizing that. Okay, lord, trust you more deeply. You're the one who gives everything. I just have to listen amen.
Joan Watson:How about you, danielle? How would you say you're different today, other than being a year older because of your birthday? How are you different today than you were when you started this adventure?
Danielle Schmitz:Just to go off of what Matthew was saying like I'm a completely different person than when I started this, in so many ways that I I don't even have words to articulate yet. It's just. I know that there's a difference and that there's a profound difference that the Lord has brought in my own life and in my own heart of just him being able to purify me and shape me the way that he wants me to look. And I know, even as I've just spent the last few weeks beginning to process the pilgrimage, that I've only hit the very tip of the iceberg of the graces that he's poured out, in all the time I spent with him. And I think the most profound thing that I've come to realize um so far has been that this summer he really gave me the grace of just um, total abandonment to divine providence and total abandonment to his will. I remember very specifically, like the moment I stepped into it, when we were at we were at Mundelein seminary and the archdiocese of Chicago, when I was sitting in their chapel, and it was this, this moment of the grace of saying, jesus, I don't. I don't want to move if you're not moving and I don't want to step if you're not stepping in front of me and really meaning it. I sort of felt like a toddler, but I was like I'm going to sit down right here and I'm not going to move until you tell me to move and just being able to now live my life like that of just trusting wherever the Lord is asking me to step with total peace, of not worrying about, like Jesus, I don't necessarily want this, this isn't what I want to be happening, but he's stepping in front of me and so and I want to be wherever he is. And I think that was something that I just was so profoundly lived out in the pilgrimage of the amount of days where I would have no idea geographically where I was. All I know is that I'm here and he's here right in front of me, and so I'm just going to keep walking behind him.
Danielle Schmitz:And so, now that we're out of pilgrimage of the, the national pilgrimage, but still pilgriming on our way to heaven, pilgriming in this new season that he has us all in, just really saying, father, your will be done, in all things, um, in a sense trying to find the way that when we'd be in a large procession and you'd be sort of like looking over the crowd, when you're in the middle or the back, like trying to see jesus, like trying to see jesus, Jesus, jesus and the monstrance and all things being at the grocery store, jesus, where are you? Um, and so I all I know now is I know that I've been changed and I can't articulate exactly how that is yet, but I know that I want his will to be done in all things and I want to completely lay down my life and service to Him in the church in whatever ways he asks of me. That's beautiful.
Joan Watson:Thank you both for sharing. I know, after being on a lot of pilgrimages and leading pilgrimages, coming off of pilgrimages can be hard to talk about because you're like you didn't experience this. How do I even begin to explain to you how I've been changed? And it can be frustrating to explain to you how I've been changed. And it can be frustrating to talk to people they just want to be like oh, how was your summer? You're like I can't even begin to talk about how my summer was, and so I'm grateful that again, you've clearly thought about and prayed about these things, but that you were able to share with us. We will never fully understand what you experienced, but you were able to share with us.
Joan Watson:And I think of the disciples. There's that great line in Acts of the Apostles where they said we can't but speak of what we've seen and heard. And so thank you for having that zeal and that joy and speaking so beautifully about what the Lord has done in our country this summer and know of our prayers, because you said so beautifully, this is Acts for you. Right Like now, you're going to go out and I can't wait to see what the Lord is going to do individually in your lives. So is there anything else you would like to finish up saying that you maybe missed or I didn't ask you about? As we wrap up?
Matthew:I just want to express a profound gratitude for being able to be here.
Matthew:You know, I really think that the stories the Lord has entrusted to us are stories that are meant to be shared, and I think too a word of encouragement that the pilgrimage, for this year at least, is over.
Matthew:There is another pilgrimage being planned in the works for the future, which is exciting, and the Congress is over for a little while. Right, we have nine years to wait for the next Congress, but our Eucharistic Lord is still waiting, and he's waiting in every single tabernacle across the country that he's still there and we're still in the midst of this Eucharistic revival. There's still so much that's happening, and so maybe, if any of the listeners didn't get a chance to actually participate in the National Eucharistic Pilgrimage of the Congress, I would just encourage you go to your church, go and spend time with our Lord. This revival is still happening and our Eucharistic Lord is still waiting. The same Jesus who walked across the country, the same Jesus who, for that matter, did everything in the gospels 2000 years ago, is in your church and he wants to see you. So don't be afraid to come to him and run to that place of intimacy and that rest that Danielle talked about with him.
Danielle Schmitz:Matthew stole my line. I was going to say if you haven't spent time with Jesus yet today, just go spend, even if it's five minutes in the parking lot of the church, just go be with him. And I also just want to add if there's anyone listening who's afraid to step into whatever you feel like the Lord is asking of you, whether it be vocationally or on mission, or just even if it's the smallest thing, if there's any um fear in what the Lord is asking of you, I just encourage you to just jump in today and give a full and complete fiat, like Our Lady, just a complete, unconditional yes to the Lord, because he will transform your life and change everything and use you to do great things. So if you're waiting for your moment to say yes to the Lord, this is the sign Say yes today today.
Joan Watson:Well, I can't add anything to those two things, so I'm just going to say thank you so much, danielle and Matthew, for sharing your time, and listeners, please share. I really think this is one of the most powerful episodes we've ever done, and so please share this with a friend, but, most of all, go find Jesus in the Blessed Sacrament. He's waiting for you, god bless.
